Maybe you could explain the "good business management" that has seen Elite plunge from a well respected supplier who developed working software that it released on time and installed on time, to today's joke who has broken software, demoralised staff and is losing money hand over fist. And yes, there is a global financial crisis but does that make you develop crap software? BTW, since, as you say, there is another thread along similar lines with LN, it couldn't perhaps be that book publishers know bugger all about running software companies could it? Let me ask. Is there a single software company in this market that has been taken over by a non-software company who is making more money than it did before? These people bought software companies for no reason other than land-grab without realising that the business models were totally different. And before you go off on another round of 'non-facts' in spite of the GFC there ARE legal software vendors around at the moment who seem to be doing quite well. But they are the ones with good products, good management and good customer focus. And I would have thought the last thing to do when times are tough is to let the good people go. But then I'm clearly not as gifted as you. But at least I have no bar tab; I don't drink.